The Dub Discussion Board: Bogus/false/inaccurate/misleading credits on dub releases

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Sean M.Oliver

Posted on Friday, December 14, 2001 - 09:09 pm:

I have been listening to Tubby's music(and dub in general) for 25 years .I don't pretend to know EVERY tune he (re)mixed,but I own at least 400 cuts attributed to him and his assistants Phillip Smart, Jammy,Scientist,Professor(not "The Mad-") etc..ALL of these mixes have a characteristic sound which indicates it was indeed mixed at his studio.Among these are his spring type reverb,the rate of his 'echoplex' (the number of times per minute it echo-ed) and one of Tubby's own favorites,the sweeping of EQ creating a whooshing or phasing sound. I can instantly recognize a mix done at Tubby's because of these very obvious characteristics. The Jamaican Recordings release titled "King Tubby's Lost Treasures" has NONE of the hallmarks of a job done at Tubby's.It is probably a recently-mixed job done by unknown persons,probably on a digital mixing board or even with editing software like Sound Forge.Among Tubby's trademrks was his ability to fade tracks in & out while other studios ( i.e.Randy's & Joe Gibbs' ) had to punch tracks on/off.On Lost Treasures the Tracks are audibly 'punched' ,not faded like Tubby's. Also the echo doesn't have the "decay" associated with the tape echo he used. In all probability these tracks were VOICED at Tubby,s but DEFINATELY NOT mixed by him during 72-84 I suppose he could've mixed these after he rebuilt his studio,but I strongly doubt it as he was involved with production not mixing. THIS IS NOT AUTHENTIC!(despite all the glowing reviews written by people who don't know much about dub)I also feel it was mixed very unimaginatively, its just fade-in-fade-out-add-echo-and-reverb-dub.I would add that Edward 'Bunny'/Striker' Lee is the man who provided the tracks to Jamaican Recordings via some licencing arrangement. He has NOT been scrupulous in the past regarding the authenticity of reissues in his name, which usually appears as 'licenced by E.Lee or S.Lee or B.Lee or 'Creole Music',etc.. Rhino Records' Dub reissues are notorious for blatantly false credits,but they are only middlemen, the blame belongs to Lee. (Authentic labels are:Blood & Fire, Pressure Sounds,Motion,Trojan,Greensleves,among others.) Recently I was checking out some of Jamaican Recordings other releases and heard part of "Skanking with the Upsetter".Lo and behold, it sounded like the Tubby LP- exactly the same-sounding mix.I hhhave not heard thier A Pablo LP,but the track listing is very similar to other Pablo comps (El Rockers,for instance) Note Jamaican Recordings does not have a website or even an e-mail.Very suspicious.Another "label" to avoid is some-thing/one called "Abraham" out of Ontario.It releases old Clocktower records (some of which are very good) but they/he also copied a B&F comp track-for-track (Dub Gone 2 Crazy) changed the title to something like King Tubby's Presents The Golden Roots Of Dub and inflicted it on an unsuspecting dub market.AVOID.Also,somone mentioned the "Dub Chill Out" CD (Music Club) available very cheaply.It claims to include Lee Perry,but none of the tracks were ever touched by him.They are all (you guessed it) Bunny Lee-produced tracks from the seventies,mixed at Tubby's by the man himself or by Jammy,(with one by Scientist,I think)Despite the false credits,it's an excellent comp of some of Tubby's best work.As far as K.Hudson's "Pick-A-Dub" LP goes,some of the tracks were mixed at/by Tubby's,and some weren't.Tubby was never credited for it.On the Blood&Fire CD,Tubby mixed(or were mixed at his studio) tks.5-12.On Gussie Clarke's recently reissued "Black Foundation Dub",Tubby mixed tks.2,3,5,7,8,10.Tks 1,4,6,9 were recorded and mixed at Joe Gibbs'"new"studio @ 24 Retirement Cr.by Errol"ET"Thompson.I'm not sure about the Pablo cut-Tubbys did a version of it but not this one.It sounds like Sylvan Morris @ Harry J's(?)same w/G.Issacs'"Pauper"dub. Anyway these are my opinions,and may be off a bit,but I'm a pretty serious dubhead and have been one for a long time.Thanks Sean Oliver seano@tds.net

interruptor

Posted on Friday, December 14, 2001 - 10:47 pm:

respect.. i am pleased to meet another Tubby maniac on this board - i can't claim i am listening to his sounds since 25 years but his unique sound, often paired with the most driving riddims of the time keep me hooked agin and again.

welcome to the board Seano!

John Foreplay

Posted on Thursday, December 27, 2001 - 02:26 am:

Howdy ppls. I have 'dub chill out' and I must agree that none of the tracks attributed to Perry sound like Perry work at all. Indeed they sound much more typical of King Tubby productions. Indeed I have the track labelled "Lee Perry's Guiding Star Dub" on a King Tubby compilation Dub Like Dirt labelled as "Guidance Dub" (exact same version!). Great song by the way.

Actually I often find tracks labelled differently on different CDs. This really sucks cos if you haven't had a chance to listen to the CD before you buy it, you often end up with a lot of tracks you already own.

As for 'pick a dub', the Blood and Fire release doesn't mention Tubby but I remember reading somewhere that it was some of tubby's earliest work. But whoever mixed it, I still rate tracks 7-11 as some of my all time favourite dub tracks. Tracks 1 and 3 are also good.
cheers. John Foreplay.

Eating Betty

Posted on Wednesday, January 23, 2002 - 11:14 am:

Yes me bredders in dub - in particular - the Tubbys sound is impossible to mistake for the sound of another mixer. That's what he was a genius mixer with his own custom board. All the other stuff above - I don't know it's a bit too picky. Certainly you want to know it's a good CD before you buy (get the reggae rough guide - Steve Barrow will steer you straight at least 60% of the time - that's my estimation - for me his rate is more like 90%).
re: tubbys: check his mixing of Freedom Sounds artists like Earl Zero, Phillip Frazer, Rod Taylor - most of them still on vinyl but crucial - he also did nixers for Prince Alla via Bertram Brown.
Tubby is a world of wonder in terms of his use of sound. If others abuse his memory that is a real bad thing - so let's educate and tell all about the dodgy albums. By the way - I never came across the album mentioned in the US...

Bri

Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 02:41 pm:

Yes Tubbys mix is unmistaken, lost treasures had me baffled and I tend to agree thjat Steve Barrow and Dom from B&F come very reputable

Bri

bin_ez

Posted on Friday, May 24, 2002 - 05:23 am:

Please give us a bit more information about this Pick a Dub scandal....its breaking my heart...Surely the Micheal Talbot Affair is a Keith Hudson production....?>? personally I find most of the tracks on pick a dub to sound unlike King Tubby's that's what I found/find so refreshing about Hudson's work....I'm gonna have to analyse it right now....see yis later

bin_ez

Posted on Friday, May 24, 2002 - 05:40 am:

http://www.roir-usa.com/scratch.htm

Could someone have a look at this page and tell me if this is a genuine album?
Who the hey is Bullwackie? What are "dub vocals"? and the Chosen Brothers, "Allen & Abel" Familyman steps away from the bass to play the drums!?!
"Back Up: Wailers", what they were standing outside in case someone was to stoned to sing? Surely the Chosen Brothers were Abel to hack the pace? Keyboards "Organ Dee" !!!!??!! Did I miss five years of reggae music? What's going on? Help me...I read about ROIR somewhere on this site earlier on....Where? Please someone look at this site....am I hallucinating? Maybe this is a genuine album and I'm just a completely out of touch stoned idiot.....

benja

Posted on Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 08:02 am:

for the skinny on any Lee Perry album check out upsetter.net

raspects to Mick Sleeper

Gary

Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 - 08:58 pm:

Hi there interesting topic - shame i'm three years late getting to it!!!

Sort of connected with this topic - i've got a few King Tubby comp CDs, and have found that sometimes the same tune can have a different title on a different CD (the Observer stuff in particular - the only title I can think of off hand, cos i dont have me cds at the moment is Jehovah Dub which is called something else on 'King Tubbys in Fine Style).

Has anyome else ever come across this? It's made me kinda wary about further on spec purchases. What about a 'dub database' of things like this? If anyone shows interest i will post back a list of 'alternate titles' etc.

Also any Lee Perry dub CD recommendations? I'd like to get a CDR of Kaya Dub...

Cheers Gary

blurrededges

Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 - 10:51 pm:

another miscrdited album is 'lee scratch perry vs I-Roy - sensimilla showdown'
aside from some tracks that sound like scientist i'm not sure who is actually on this one tho.

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